2023-78 ED SCHOOL SOCIAL WORKER CERTIFICATION CODE  
Public Hearing Transcribed Comments  
Department of Educaꢀon  
Office of Educator Excellence  
Administraꢀve Rules for School Social Worker Cerꢀficaꢀon  
Rule Set 2023-78 ED  
TUESDAY APRIL 9, 2024 1:00PM – 5:00PM  
LIBRARY OF MICHIGAN FORUM 702 W. KALAMAZOO ST., LANSING, MI 48911  
Moderators: Krista Ried Ed. Consultant Manager (Office of Educator Excellence)  
Nancy Rotarius, Special Educaꢀon Consultant (Office of Special Educaꢀon)  
In Aꢁendance: Ashley Reed, Chantel Mozden, Scoꢁ Wertheim, Kaꢀe Schmiedeknecht, Deborah  
Schultz, Gina Garner, Allison Sandbrook  
Interpreters: Candice Barrier, Autumn Chestnut, April Davidson  
13:00:15 Nancy Rotarius: Good afternoon my name is Nancy Rotarius, State Policy Coordinator with the  
Michigan Department of Education Office of Special Education.  
13:00:37 Krista Ried: My name is Krista Ried, also from the Department, I am the Manager of the  
Professional Educator Certification Services unit within the Office of Educator Excellence.  
Together we will conduct today’s public hearing.  
This is a public hearing on proposed administrative rules, 2023-76, Michigan Administrative Rules for  
Special Education, 2023-79 Teacher Certification Code, 2023-78 School Social Worker Certification Code,  
and administrative rules 2023-77 Teacher and School Administrator Evaluation Tools. This public  
hearing is conducted as required by the Administrative Procedures Act to allow the public to comment  
on proposed changes to this rule set.  
As with all other public hearings on draft rule sets, the only items to be heard during this hearing will be  
proposed changes to the rule sets. This hearing will not cover any questions or discussions other than  
those issues.  
13:02:18 Krista Ried: If you have questions about the proposed rule changes to the Teacher Certification  
Code, Teacher and School Administrator Evaluation Tools, School Social Worker Certification Code or  
other general certification questions, please contact the MDE-OEE support team at 517-241-5000 or  
MDE-EducatorHelp@Michigan.gov  
13:02:47 Nancy Rotarius : If you have questions about the proposed rule changes to the Michigan  
Administrative Rules for Special Education, School Social Worker Certification Code, or other special  
education questions, please contact the MDE OSE information desk at 1-888-320-8384 or MDE-  
OSE@Michigan.gov  
13:04:13 We are calling this hearing to order at 1:05 PM on April 9, 2024, via zoom. Notice of this  
hearing was published on April 1, 2024, in the Michigan Register, in addition to three newspapers of  
general circulation Detroit Free Press, Grand Rapids Press, and Marquette Mining Journal as well as the  
Michigan Register, Issue 5 published on April 1, 2024.  
All comments should relate directly to the proposed rules. Before you comment, please indicate which  
rule set you are speaking on. If you have suggested changes to the proposed rules, please include the  
specific reasons why the changes would be in the public interest. Copies of both proposed rule changes  
are available outside of the library forum on the table.  
For those in person if you are interested in providing comment, please indicate this on the signup sheet  
outside this room. Individuals will be called upon based on the order of the signup.  
For those using the video conference portion of the Zoom. please use the raise your hand feature at the  
bottom of the screen. You can also raise your hand using the following short cuts: Add these directions  
to chat. Windows: You can also use theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand. Mac: You  
can also use theꢂOption+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
If you prefer, we will accept comments added to the chat. The comments in the chat will be saved into a  
transcript as part of the public comment record. Please note we will not respond to questions or  
comments submitted via chat and be sure to identify which rule you are commenting on.  
For participants accessing today’s public hearing by telephone, we will ask if you wish to comment after  
the video participants have finished.  
I will call on individuals to speak and they will be unmuted at that time. When you speak, please identify  
yourself and the organization you represent, so the information is transcribed into the hearing  
report. We will limit comments to three minutes per person.  
If you have a comment on the special education rules but do not wish to speak the Office of Special  
Education will accept written comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducation under “OSE  
Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.” You may also submit comments via email at mde-  
ose-public-comment@michigan.gov or mail written comments to: Public Comment, Office of Special  
Education, Michigan Department of Education, P.O. Box 30008, Lansing, Michigan 48909. All comments  
must be received no later than by 5:00 p.m. on April 19, 2024.  
13:09:28 Krista Ried: If you have a comment on the Teacher Certification Code, School Social Worker  
Certification Code, or administrative rules for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluation Tools but do  
not wish to speak, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept written comments submitted online at:  
https://bit.ly/4cRkOmO. You may also mail written comments to: Public Comment Office of Educator  
Excellence, Michigan Department of Education, P.O. Box 30008, Lansing, Michigan 48909, All comments  
must be received no later than by 5:00 p.m. on April 19, 2024.  
5 minutes 34 seconds  
If there are no other parꢀcipants who wish to speak at this ꢀme, we will take a short recess.  
5:40  
5 minutes 40 seconds  
The ꢀme is now 1:35 PM.  
5:55  
5 minutes 55 seconds  
OK.  
5:58  
5 minutes 58 seconds  
The ꢀme is now 120, 158.  
6:02  
6 minutes 2 seconds  
We are reconvening the hearing.  
6:05  
6 minutes 5 seconds  
If you wish to provide comments, please raise your hand and we will unmute you and you can turn your  
camera on as well.  
13:33  
13 minutes 33 seconds  
Time is now two O 6.  
13:36  
13 minutes 36 seconds  
If there is no other people who wish to speak at this ꢀme, we will take a recess.  
13:41  
13 minutes 41 seconds  
Again, the ꢀme is two O 6 A243.  
13:51  
13 minutes 51 seconds  
We are opening up back the public comment.  
13:54  
13 minutes 54 seconds  
If there is anyone who is virtual and would like to provide comment, please raise your hand.  
14:08  
14 minutes 8 seconds  
Kelly, I see your camera is on.  
14:10  
14 minutes 10 seconds  
Would you like to provide comment?  
20:14  
20 minutes 14 seconds  
No other people who wish to speak at this ꢀme.  
20:17  
20 minutes 17 seconds  
We will take a short recess.  
20:19  
20 minutes 19 seconds  
The ꢀme is now 250.  
Recorded Audio via live mic in room (transcribed)  
1
00:00:03.990 --> 00:00:10.250  
Nancy Rotarius: Good aꢃernoon. My name is Nancy Rotarius, state policy coordinator with the Michigan  
Department.  
2
00:00:10.460 --> 00:00:13.450  
MDE OSE: Of Educaꢀon Office of Special Educaꢀon.  
3
00:00:13.790 --> 00:00:14.469  
MDE OSE: If we.  
4
00:00:19.440 --> 00:00:27.679  
MDE OSE: My name is Krista Reed, also from the Department. I am the manager of the Professional  
educator cerꢀficaꢀon services unit within the office of educator excellence.  
5
00:00:28.220 --> 00:00:31.080  
MDE OSE: Together we will be conducꢀng today's public hearing.  
6
00:00:34.180 --> 00:00:43.390  
MDE OSE: This is a public hearing on proposed administraꢀve rules 2023, 76, Michigan administraꢀve  
rules for special educaꢀon.  
7
00:00:43.490 --> 00:00:44.750  
MDE OSE: 2020,  
8
00:00:44.780 --> 00:00:49.040  
MDE OSE: 3, 79, teacher, cerꢀficaꢀon, cerꢀficaꢀon, code  
9
00:00:49.100 --> 00:01:02.560  
MDE OSE: 2023, 78, social school social work, cerꢀficaꢀon, code and administraꢀve rules, 2023, 77,  
teacher and school administrator. Evaluaꢀon tools.  
10  
00:01:02.720 --> 00:01:07.750  
MDE OSE: This public hearing is conducted as required by the Administraꢀve Procedures Act  
11  
00:01:07.940 --> 00:01:12.979  
MDE OSE: to allow the public to comment on proposed changes to this rule, set.  
12  
00:01:13.610 --> 00:01:22.419  
MDE OSE: as with all other public hearings on draꢃ rule, sets the only items to be heard during this  
hearing will be proposed. Changes to the rule. Set  
13  
00:01:22.620 --> 00:01:27.700  
MDE OSE: this hearing will not cover any quesꢀons or discussions other than those issues.  
14  
00:01:28.970 --> 00:01:30.270  
MDE OSE: Do you have quesꢀons.  
15  
00:01:30.270 --> 00:01:32.590  
Nadia Vann: And we annual changes to the teachers'.  
16  
00:01:32.590 --> 00:01:33.799  
MDE OSE: Cerꢀficaꢀon code.  
17  
00:01:34.100 --> 00:01:34.870  
Jeanneꢁe Stach: Mornings.  
18  
00:01:35.000 --> 00:01:36.749  
Jeanneꢁe Stach: Sorry Andrew Volley's  
19  
00:01:38.150 --> 00:01:38.799  
Jeanneꢁe Stach: well, so.  
20  
00:01:38.800 --> 00:01:40.930  
MDE OSE: Worker, cerꢀficaꢀon code.  
21  
00:01:40.950 --> 00:01:43.460  
MDE OSE: Other general cerꢀficaꢀon quesꢀons  
22  
00:01:43.530 --> 00:01:46.389  
MDE OSE: please. Contact the MDE.  
23  
00:01:48.860 --> 00:01:50.290  
MDE OSE: 5, 1, 7,  
24  
00:01:50.350 --> 00:01:52.979  
MDE OSE: 2, 4, 1, 5,000,  
25  
00:01:53.100 --> 00:01:56.910  
MDE OSE: or MDE. Hyphen educator help  
26  
00:01:57.040 --> 00:01:58.469  
MDE OSE: at Michigan, Gov.  
27  
00:02:01.180 --> 00:02:29.900  
MDE OSE: If you have quesꢀons about the proposed changes to the Michigan administraꢀve rules for  
special educaꢀon. So so school social work, cerꢀficaꢀon code or other special Ed. Quesꢀons please  
contact the MDEO. SE. Informaꢀon desk at (188) 320-8384, or MDEO. SE. At Michigan, Gov.  
28  
00:02:30.820 --> 00:02:41.770  
MDE OSE: We are calling this hearing to order at 1 4 on April ninth, 2024, via Zoom and in person at the  
library of Michigan.  
29  
00:02:41.910 --> 00:02:49.509  
MDE OSE: Noꢀce of this hearing was published on April first 2024 in the Michigan registry.  
30  
00:02:49.590 --> 00:02:58.610  
MDE OSE: in addiꢀon to 3 newspapers of general circulaꢀon, Detroit, Free Press, Grand Rapids Press, and  
the Market Mining Journal.  
31  
00:02:59.910 --> 00:03:04.089  
MDE OSE: All quesꢀons should relate directly to the proposed rules.  
32  
00:03:04.160 --> 00:03:08.570  
MDE OSE: Before you comment, please indicate which rule set you are speaking on.  
33  
00:03:08.800 --> 00:03:18.259  
MDE OSE: If you have any suggested changes to the proposed rules, please include the specific reasons  
why the changes would be of public interest.  
34  
00:03:18.570 --> 00:03:29.850  
MDE OSE: Copies of both proposed rules are available outside the library form on a table as well as A.  
QP. QR. Code is available, and the link will be put in the chat  
35  
00:03:30.390 --> 00:03:34.989  
MDE OSE: for those who are in person. If you are interested in providing comment.  
36  
00:03:35.050 --> 00:03:39.139  
MDE OSE: please indicate this on the sign-up sheet outside the table.  
37  
00:03:39.150 --> 00:03:41.600  
MDE OSE: Individuals we we called upon  
38  
00:03:41.820 --> 00:03:43.789  
MDE OSE: in the order of the sign up  
39  
00:03:43.950 --> 00:03:47.669  
MDE OSE: for those using the video conference porꢀon of Zoom.  
40  
00:03:47.700 --> 00:03:51.790  
MDE OSE: Please use the raise your hand feature at the boꢁom of the screen.  
41  
00:03:51.950 --> 00:03:58.460  
MDE OSE: You can also raise your hand using the following shortcuts. These direcꢀons will be added to  
the chat  
42  
00:03:58.790 --> 00:04:03.169  
MDE OSE: in windows. You can use the alt plus y keyboard  
43  
00:04:03.210 --> 00:04:06.049  
MDE OSE: shortcut to raise or lower your hand  
44  
00:04:06.900 --> 00:04:14.230  
MDE OSE: on a Mac. You can use the opꢀon plus y keyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
45  
00:04:14.610 --> 00:04:16.200  
MDE OSE: If you prefer.  
46  
00:04:16.209 --> 00:04:19.400  
MDE OSE: we will accept comments added to the chat  
47  
00:04:20.790 --> 00:04:31.329  
MDE OSE: we will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish. When you're providing  
comment, the comments in the chat will be saved into transcripts as part of the public comment record.  
48  
00:04:31.660 --> 00:04:41.260  
MDE OSE: Please note, we will not respond to quesꢀons or comments submiꢁed via chat, and will be  
sure to idenꢀfy which rule you are commenꢀng on when you provide comments  
49  
00:04:41.770 --> 00:04:46.039  
MDE OSE: for parꢀcipants accessing today's public hearing by telephone.  
50  
00:04:46.080 --> 00:04:51.100  
MDE OSE: we will ask if you wish to comment. Aꢃer the video parꢀcipants have finished.  
51  
00:04:51.810 --> 00:04:56.619  
MDE OSE: we will call on individuals to speak as they are unmuted at the ꢀme  
52  
00:04:57.150 --> 00:05:02.360  
MDE OSE: when you speak, please idenꢀfy yourself and the organizaꢀon you represent.  
53  
00:05:02.750 --> 00:05:06.989  
MDE OSE: So the informaꢀon is transcribed into the hearing report.  
54  
00:05:07.390 --> 00:05:10.929  
MDE OSE: We will limit comments to 3 min per person.  
55  
00:05:11.410 --> 00:05:16.599  
MDE OSE: If you have a comment on the special Ed rules, but do not wish to speak.  
56  
00:05:17.010 --> 00:05:26.479  
MDE OSE: The office of Special educaꢀon will accept wriꢁen comments online@www.michigan, Gov.  
57  
00:05:26.640 --> 00:05:30.199  
MDE OSE: Forward slash special educaꢀon  
58  
00:05:30.450 --> 00:05:35.239  
MDE OSE: under the OS. Spotlight. Public comment for proposed rule changes.  
59  
00:05:35.450 --> 00:05:41.300  
MDE OSE: You may also submit wriꢁen comments via email at MDE.  
60  
00:05:41.450 --> 00:05:44.210  
MDE OSE: Dash, OSE.  
61  
00:05:44.370 --> 00:05:46.020  
MDE OSE: Dash, public  
62  
00:05:46.260 --> 00:05:48.010  
MDE OSE: dash, comment  
63  
00:05:48.320 --> 00:05:50.889  
MDE OSE: at michigan.gov.  
64  
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MDE OSE: Or male wriꢁen comments too.  
65  
00:05:54.000 --> 00:05:55.760  
MDE OSE: Public comment.  
66  
00:05:55.990 --> 00:05:58.379  
MDE OSE: office of Special Educaꢀon.  
67  
00:05:58.590 --> 00:06:01.169  
MDE OSE: Michigan. Department of Educaꢀon.  
68  
00:06:01.450 --> 00:06:04.819  
MDE OSE: PO. Box 3,  
69  
00:06:04.890 --> 00:06:08.679  
MDE OSE: 0 0 0 8,  
70  
00:06:08.830 --> 00:06:14.840  
MDE OSE: Lansing, Michigan. 48909.  
71  
00:06:15.350 --> 00:06:22.099  
MDE OSE: All comments must be received no later than 5 PM. On April nineteenth.  
72  
00:06:27.220 --> 00:06:35.019  
MDE OSE: have a comment on the teacher. Cerꢀficaꢀon code, school social workers, cerꢀficaꢀon code or  
administraꢀve rules for teacher and  
73  
00:06:37.520 --> 00:06:38.710  
MDE OSE: not wish to speak.  
74  
00:06:38.740 --> 00:06:42.209  
MDE OSE: The office of Educator excellence will accept wriꢁen comments.  
75  
00:06:44.130 --> 00:06:46.650  
MDE OSE: HTTP. S.  
76  
00:06:54.240 --> 00:06:55.740  
MDE OSE: LY.  
77  
00:06:55.970 --> 00:06:57.390  
MDE OSE: Forward slash  
78  
00:06:57.510 --> 00:06:58.560  
MDE OSE: 4  
79  
00:07:00.800 --> 00:07:02.030  
MDE OSE: capital R.  
80  
00:07:02.710 --> 00:07:04.100  
MDE OSE: For case K.  
81  
00:07:08.670 --> 00:07:09.930  
MDE OSE: Capital. O,  
82  
00:07:11.740 --> 00:07:14.610  
MDE OSE: you may also mail wriꢁen comments to  
83  
00:07:14.750 --> 00:07:16.270  
MDE OSE: public comment.  
84  
00:07:16.670 --> 00:07:18.999  
MDE OSE: Office of educator. Excellence.  
85  
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MDE OSE: Michigan. Department of Educaꢀon.  
86  
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MDE OSE: EO. Box 3, 0 0 8  
87  
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MDE OSE: Lansing, Michigan.  
88  
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MDE OSE: 4, 8, 9. 9.  
89  
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MDE OSE: All comments must be received no later than by 5 PM. On April nineteenth, 2,024  
90  
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MDE OSE: out, and the mics are not picking up, because I think  
91  
00:07:58.820 --> 00:07:59.939  
MDE OSE: you need to mute  
92  
00:08:04.160 --> 00:08:05.499  
MDE OSE: pound is turned off  
93  
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MDE OSE: that works beꢁer. Can people hear me now? Those of you online?  
94  
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MDE OSE: Oh.  
95  
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MDE OSE: if money can be done in the 2 of us  
96  
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MDE OSE: see if that's beꢁer, beꢁer, beꢁer.  
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MDE OSE: liꢁle beꢁer. Okay.  
98  
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MDE OSE: hopefully, you don't have to hear me talk  
99  
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MDE OSE: much.  
100  
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MDE OSE: And if there's anyone online that would parꢀcipate.  
101  
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MDE OSE: I comment, please use the  
102  
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MDE OSE: funcꢀon.  
103  
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MDE OSE: Also put informaꢀon in the chat about how to use shortcuts.  
104  
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Nancy Rotarius: Just a reminder if you're virtually and would like to provide comments. Please use the  
raise your hand, buꢁon.  
105  
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Nancy Rotarius: Having heavy, knowing that amazing.  
106  
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MDE OSE: We're online that would like to provide comments.  
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MDE OSE: We are going to recess.  
108  
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MDE OSE: That's now 1, 12  
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MDE OSE: is 1, 29. We are reconvening the hearing.  
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MDE OSE: If there is anyone virtually that would like to provide comments, please use the raise your  
hand, buꢁon, and we will unmute you and turn your camera on if you wish.  
Relevant Tesꢀmony  
15:15:05 Nancy Rotarius: Addiꢀonal informaꢀon is in the chat for ASL Interpreters to provide comment.  
15:18:27 Kristen Whiston: Hello, can you hear me?  
15:18:32 Nancy Rotarius: We cannot hear you.  
15:19:17 Kristen Whiston: Can you hear me now?  
15:19:32 Nancy Rotarius: Yes  
15:20:13 Kristen Whiston: Um, so it's my understanding that these proposed changes applies to  
those who work with children with social work services listed on their IEP, but it does not apply  
towards those who work in a general educaꢀon seꢁng or with general educaꢀon students. Um,  
it's also my understanding that these proposed changes were created to strengthen the field of  
social work.  
But I have some concerns about that and whether or not it would help the field of school social  
worker or be detrimental to the field, and most importantly, to our children, um, or our students  
that it's meant to, um, strengthen. So, um, to me, these proposed changes do not apply to  
school social workers in general educaꢀon seꢁng. That's my understanding of it.  
Um, but I feel that all students should have quality school social workers who are cerꢀfied school  
social workers. Um, these challenges and language to me opens it up for schools to contract out  
school social workers or social workers, um, potenꢀally to those who would provide services  
remotely or telehealth. And while I have seen and there is definite research that has shown the  
posiꢀve of that, um, to me it's also a concern. School social workers provide more than the  
services that are wriꢂen down on paper.  
We are the friendly faces outside at recess. We're helping in the cafeteria. We're around our  
school buildings and a lot of ways as a reminder that we are a space where students can go to  
that they can talk about their concerns. Um, and we also play a really big role now in school  
safety. Um, many school social workers are part of the criꢀcal response teams, something that if  
you're not a cerꢀfied school social worker, if you're contracted out, you may not be a part of that  
team. And to me, we play a very large role in that, in keeping safety with students. I do know  
that there is a shortage of school social workers, but we have also worked on smart bills and  
other legislaꢀon to help, um, increase the number of school social workers, um, for the  
profession, for school social workers, I think it could be detrimental.  
Um, we, uh, have the experience and the means to work in schools. We have the background,  
we've taken the courses, we're involved in school culture, and we're part of it, whether it be  
aꢂending aꢃer school acꢀviꢀes and programs, something that if you're not employed by the  
district, you may not have to do. And aꢂending those are very important and valuable. Um, to  
me, uh, this is going to be a liꢂle salty, but it kind of feels a way to cut corners, to save money, to  
not provide the best services to our children.  
Um, and I really quesꢀon that. Um, addiꢀonally, there was language on introducing 75  
educaꢀonal related professional learning hours, and I have a few quesꢀons about that. Um, you  
know, how are they tracked? How are they submiꢂed? Is it an honor system? Is there a website?  
Who's in charge of it? Is it us as individual social workers? Is it our districts or our schools? Is it  
the intermediate school district? How and what does that process look like?  
Addiꢀonally, as stated, as a school social worker, currently my professional development, my  
conꢀnuing educaꢀonal hours are oꢃen for me to find on my own. Um, there's very few provided  
by districts and especially, you know, my district provides some, but definitely not all of my  
hours. Um, furthermore, the district provided professional development does not currently apply  
or go towards those hours for myself. So moving forward, would that change? Would district  
provided professional development be part of those 75 hours? I don't know. Um, and would I be,  
you know, again, I find them on my own. Would I be reimbursed for that, for my ꢀme for going  
to these places to get these, if that is part of my cerꢀficaꢀon as a school social worker? Um,  
addiꢀonally, these hours appear to only be necessary for those cerꢀfied school social workers or  
those social workers who have special educaꢀon, um, students that have IEPs with social work  
hours.  
Um, so again, it appears to be only necessary for those, not those who would work with general  
educaꢀon students. And to me, that would further divide the difference between a cerꢀfied  
school social worker and those without the cerꢀficaꢀon. And I think this will negaꢀvely impact  
both the field of social work and and those who maꢂer most, which are students. Um, and  
overall, the idea of this I'm not against there's just language in it with that I am. And while I  
appreciate really the thought of this, and I believe, um, the intent is to strengthen the field of  
school social worker, I feel that these changes, as they are wriꢂen, as they are currently stated,  
really do the opposite of what they do and I fear it will hurt the profession, it'll hurt  
professionals, and most importantly. Wait. I really am concerned that it will impact negaꢀvely  
our students and our children. Um, so thank you for your ꢀme, your consideraꢀon for my  
concerns. Again, I'm Kristen Whiston an approved school social worker. Thank you.  
0:04  
0 minutes 4 seconds  
Time is now 457.  
0:07  
0 minutes 7 seconds  
I hereby declare the hearing closed if you have further comments.  
0:11  
0 minutes 11 seconds  
The opposite Special Education will accept written comments at www.michigan.gov/special  
Education under O Spotlight comment for proposed rule.  
0:24  
0 minutes 24 seconds  
You may also submit comments via e-mail at MDE dashose-public-comment@michigan.gov or mail  
written comments to public comment Office of Special Education, Michigan Department of  
Education, PO Box 30008, Lansing, MI 489-O9.  
0:52  
0 minutes 52 seconds  
If you have a comment on Teacher Certification Code, School social Worker certification code, or  
administrative rules for Teacher and school administrator evaluation tools but do not wish to speak  
the Office of Educator Excellence, I'm just going to keep going.  
1:15  
1 minute 15 seconds  
For all those of you listening, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept written comments  
submitted online at HTTPS:// BIT.  
1:31  
1 minute 31 seconds  
LY/ 4 lowercase C, uppercase R, lowercase K, uppercase O, lowercase M, uppercase O You may also  
mail written comments to public comment.  
1:51  
1 minute 51 seconds  
Office of Educator Excellence, Michigan Department of Education EO Box 30008 Lansing, MI 489-O9  
All comments must be received no later than 5:00 PM on April 19th, 2024.  
2:15  
2 minutes 15 seconds  
Coming.  
16:58:01 Nancy Rotarius: The time is now 4:58 PM If you have further comments, the Office of Special  
Education will also accept written comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducation under “OSE  
Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.” You may also submit comments via email at mde-  
ose-public-comment@michigan.gov or mail written comments to, Public Comment, Office of Special  
Education, Michigan Department of Education, P.O. Box 30008, Lansing, Michigan 48909  
17:01:18 Krista Ried: If you have a comment on the Teacher Certification Code, School Social Worker  
Certification Code, or administrative rules for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluation Tools but do  
not wish to speak, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept written comments submitted online at:  
https://bit.ly/4cRkOmO. You may also mail written comments to, Public Comment, Office of Educator  
Excellence, Michigan Department of Education, P.O. Box 30008  
Lansing, Michigan 48909, All comments must be received no later than by 5:00 p.m. on April 19, 2024,  
Thank you for coming.  
Zoom Chat Transcripts  
13:01:22 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to Everyone:  
During this meeꢀng, there will be (2) American Sign Language Interpreters (ASL) present:  
Autumn C. and April D. You will be seeing the gallery view during the presentaꢀon which will  
allow for the Acꢀve Speaker's video to be on as well as the ASL interpreters video. Because of  
the gallery view, you will want to follow these steps to hid the non-video panelists.  
13:01:30 From ASHLEY REED to Nancy Rotarius(direct message):  
You going to give me the begin que from there?  
13:02:06 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to Everyone:  
Go to Video Seꢄngs. Then select Hide Non-Video Parꢀcipants to hide all parꢀcipants without  
video.  
13:03:05 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to ASHLEY REED(direct message):  
We cannot hear them. They need to talk right into the mike.  
13:03:47 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to ASHLEY REED(direct message):  
WE cannot hear Krista at all.  
13:04:32 From ASHLEY REED to Nancy Rotarius(direct message):  
Please speak directly into your microphones, we are having trouble hearing Krista.  
13:06:15 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to Everyone:  
We will take your comments in the following manner: For those using the video conference  
porꢀon of the Zoom, please use the raise your hand feature at the boꢁom of the screen. You  
can also raise your hand using the following short cuts:  
Windows: You can also use theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
Mac: You can also use theꢂOpꢀon+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
13:06:42 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to Everyone:  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
13:29:03 From Precious Boone (she/her) (MI-DOE) to ASHLEY REED(direct message):  
I can't hear anything on zoom.  
13:29:19 From Precious Boone (she/her) (MI-DOE) to ASHLEY REED(direct message):  
Okay. Good now.  
13:35:00 From ASHLEY REED to Nancy Rotarius(direct message):  
We are sꢀll in session...correct?  
13:40:35 From Steven Whitmore to Everyone:  
I have two comments that I would like to put in the chat.  
13:41:48 From Steven Whitmore to Everyone:  
Steven Whitmore, LMSW, School Social Work Consultant at Oakland Schools  
I have two comments:  
Regarding the proposed School Social Work Cerꢀficaꢀon Code Changes  
There are a number of school social workers right now in Public Schools that are concerned  
about the lack of professional recogniꢀon of the term “school social worker” for those social  
workers who do not have a special educaꢀon caseload, but service only students in general  
educaꢀon. For general educaꢀon students, there is a concern that either non-trained school-  
related social workers or other student staff will be brought in to service students without the  
understanding, training and/or experꢀse that school social workers provide. This might lead to  
appropriate services being provided for students and/or possibly a lack of recogniꢀon of when  
special educaꢀons might be needed.  
13:42:02 From Steven Whitmore to Everyone:  
Addiꢀonally, we are concerned about non-qualified social work personnel (or others without  
appropriate credenꢀals) being used for eligibility consideraꢀon for eligibility other than ASD and  
EI.  
13:42:16 From Steven Whitmore to Everyone:  
Re- R340.1004:  
Regarding the need for 75 educaꢀon-related professional learning hours needed in a five year  
period. I would like to propose that the policies allow for those appropriate LARA approved  
professional learning conꢀnuing educaꢀon courses to be allowed without the need for  
addiꢀonal payment for these courses in the MOECs system. There might be undue hardship for  
those having to pay for a conꢀnuing educaꢀon program, paying an addiꢀonal fee for the LARA  
credits themselves and then paying another fee for SCECH type credits.  
13:47:46 From Nancy Rotarius to Everyone:  
We are currently on recess, microphones and recording are paused.  
13:59:14 From Steven Whitmore to Everyone:  
Have my comments been seen?  
13:59:37 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
Reacted to "Steven Whitmore, LMS..." with  
Windows: You can also use theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
Mac: You can also use theꢂOpꢀon+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
14:01:24 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
14:03:02 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
If you have a comment on the special educaꢀon rules but do not wish to speak the Office of  
Special Educaꢀon will accept wriꢁen comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducaꢀon  
under “OSE Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.”  
14:03:19 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
If you have a comment on the Teacher Cerꢀficaꢀon Code, School Social Worker Cerꢀficaꢀon  
Code, or administraꢀve rules for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluaꢀon Tools but do not  
wish to speak, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept wriꢁen comments submiꢁed online  
at: hꢁps://bit.ly/4cRkOmO.  
14:07:29 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We are currently on recess, microphones and recording are paused.  
14:45:23 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
During this meeꢀng, there will be (2) American Sign Language Interpreters (ASL) present:  
Autumn C. and April D. You will be seeing the gallery view during the presentaꢀon which will  
allow for the Acꢀve Speaker's video to be on as well as the ASL interpreters video. Because of  
the gallery view, you will want to follow these steps to hid the non-video panelists.  
We will take your comments in the following manner: For those using the video conference  
porꢀon of the Zoom, please use the raise your hand feature at the boꢁom of the screen. You  
can also raise your hand using the following short cuts:  
Windows: You can also use theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
Mac: You can also use theꢂOpꢀon+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
14:46:02 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
If you have a comment on the special educaꢀon rules but do not wish to speak the Office of  
Special Educaꢀon will accept wriꢁen comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducaꢀon  
under “OSE Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.”  
If you have a comment on the Teacher Cerꢀficaꢀon Code, School Social Worker Cerꢀficaꢀon  
Code, or administraꢀve rules for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluaꢀon Tools but do not  
wish to speak, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept wriꢁen comments submiꢁed online  
at: hꢁps://bit.ly/4cRkOmO.  
14:50:28 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We are currently on recess, microphones and recording are paused.  
15:10:15 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
During this meeꢀng, there will be (2) American Sign Language Interpreters (ASL) present:  
Autumn C. and April D. You will be seeing the gallery view during the presentaꢀon which will  
allow for the Acꢀve Speaker's video to be on as well as the ASL interpreters video. Because of  
the gallery view, you will want to follow these steps to hid the non-video panelists.  
We will take your comments in the following manner: For those using the video conference  
porꢀon of the Zoom, please use the raise your hand feature at the boꢁom of the screen. You  
can also raise your hand using the following short cuts:  
Windows: You can also use theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
Mac: You can also use theꢂOpꢀon+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
15:10:34 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
If you have a comment on the special educaꢀon rules but do not wish to speak the Office of  
Special Educaꢀon will accept wriꢁen comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducaꢀon  
under “OSE Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.”  
If you have a comment on the Teacher Cerꢀficaꢀon Code, School Social Worker Cerꢀficaꢀon  
Code, or administraꢀve rules for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluaꢀon Tools but do not  
wish to speak, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept wriꢁen comments submiꢁed online  
at: hꢁps://bit.ly/4cRkOmO.  
15:26:43 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
During this meeꢀng, there will be (2) American Sign Language Interpreters (ASL) present:  
Autumn C. and April D. You will be seeing the gallery view during the presentaꢀon which will  
allow for the Acꢀve Speaker's video to be on as well as the ASL interpreters video. Because of  
the gallery view, you will want to follow these steps to hid the non-video panelists.  
We will take your comments in the following manner: For those using the video conference  
porꢀon of the Zoom, please use the raise your hand feature at the boꢁom of the screen. You  
can also raise your hand using the following short cuts:  
Windows: You can also use theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
Mac: You can also use theꢂOpꢀon+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
15:26:54 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
If you have a comment on the special educaꢀon rules but do not wish to speak the Office of  
Special Educaꢀon will accept wriꢁen comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducaꢀon  
under “OSE Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.”  
If you have a comment on the Teacher Cerꢀficaꢀon Code, School Social Worker Cerꢀficaꢀon  
Code, or administraꢀve rules for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluaꢀon Tools but do not  
wish to speak, the Office of Educator Excellence will accept wriꢁen comments submiꢁed online  
at: hꢁps://bit.ly/4cRkOmO.  
15:30:34 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We are currently on recess, microphones and recording are paused.  
16:01:04 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to Everyone:  
We will take your comments in the following manner: For those using the video conference  
porꢀon of the Zoom, please use the raise your hand feature at the boꢁom of the screen. You  
can also raise your hand using the following short cuts: Windows: You can also use  
theꢂAlt+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand. Mac: You can also use  
theꢂOpꢀon+Yꢂkeyboard shortcut to raise or lower your hand.  
16:01:46 From Chantel Mozden (MDE OSE) to Everyone:  
We will unmute you and allow you to turn your camera on, if you wish.  
If you have a comment on the special educaꢀon rules but do not wish to speak the Office of  
Special Educaꢀon will accept wriꢁen comments online at www.michigan.gov/specialeducaꢀon  
under “OSE Spotlight-Public comment for proposed rule changes.” If you have a comment on  
the Teacher Cerꢀficaꢀon Code, School Social Worker Cerꢀficaꢀon Code, or administraꢀve rules  
for Teacher and School Administrator Evaluaꢀon Tools but do not wish to speak, the Office of  
Educator Excellence will accept wriꢁen comments submiꢁed online at:  
hꢁps://mde.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_73asZyiBl1OCezk.  
16:05:46 From Krista Ried to Everyone:  
We are currently on recess; microphones and recording are paused.  
;