1
1
2
STATE OF MICHIGAN  
DEPARTMENT OF LICENSING AND REGULATORY AFFAIRS  
BUREAU OF PROFESSIONAL LICENSING  
- - -  
3
4
5
PUBLIC HEARING  
6
FRIDAY, MAY 16, 2025  
7
AT ABOUT 9:00 A.M.  
8
- - -  
9
OTTAWA BUILDING  
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
611 W. OTTAWA STREET, UL-5  
LANSING, MICHIGAN  
- - -  
RE: Medicine - General Rules (MOAHR #2024-64 LR)  
Sanitarians - General Rules (MOAHR #2024-60 LR)  
- - -  
16 HEARING FACILITATOR:  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
WESTON MacINTOSH  
Bureau of Professional Licensing  
611 W. Ottawa Street  
Lansing, Michigan 48909  
DEPARTMENT STAFF:  
Kerry Przybylo  
- - -  
REPORTED BY: Lori Anne Penn, CSR-1315  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
2
1
I N D E X  
2 Opening Statement - Weston MacIntosh  
3
3
- - -  
4 COMMENTS:  
PAGE  
5
5
6
Karlene Ketola - Medicine  
- - -  
7 Closing Statement - Weston MacIntosh  
8
8
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
3
1
2
Lansing, Michigan  
Friday, May 16, 2025  
At 9:00 a.m.  
3
4
- - -  
5
(Public hearing commenced pursuant to due notice.)  
MR. MacINTOSH: Good morning. My name is  
6
7
Weston MacIntosh, and I'm a Departmental Specialist for  
the Bureau of Professional Licensing in the Department of  
Licensing and Regulatory Affairs, and I will be  
conducting the hearing today.  
8
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
This is a public hearing on the proposed  
administrative rules entitled "Medicine - General Rules"  
and "Sanitarians Registration - General Rules". We are  
conducting this hearing under the authority of the  
Administrative Procedures Act, Public Act 306 of 1969, on  
behalf of the Department of Licensing and Regulatory  
Affairs, Bureau of Professional Licensing.  
We are calling this hearing to order at  
9:00 o'clock a.m. on May 16, 2025, in UL-5, at 611 West  
Ottawa Street, Lansing, Michigan. Publication of the  
notice of public hearing was in three newspapers of  
general circulation, including the Flint Journal on  
April 29, 2025, the Grand Rapids Press on April 29, 2025,  
the Escanaba Daily Press on April 28, 2025, as well as  
the Michigan Register, Issue No. 8, published on May 15,  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
4
1
2
2025.  
We are here today to receive your  
3
comments on the proposed rules. If you wish to speak,  
please make sure you have signed in and said that you  
wish to speak. You may use the cards supplied for this  
purpose. I'll organize the cards by rule set so that the  
comments for that profession are in a group together in  
the transcript. If you'd like to testify and have not  
signed in, please do so now. For those of you who do not  
wish to sign with a card, you make speak once we have  
exhausted the stack of cards you that give to me.  
If you have comments, please make sure  
4
5
6
7
8
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
they relate directly to the proposed rules. If you have  
questions about the rules, please include your questions  
as part of your testimony for the Department's review.  
If you have suggested changes to the proposed rules,  
please include the specific reasons why the changes would  
be in the public interest.  
For the record, when you testify, please  
give us your name by spelling your name and the  
organization, if any, that you may be speaking for today.  
This will help the Department prepare the hearing record  
that will go before the Boards. You can give written  
statements directly to me at the table. The Department  
will also accept written statements emailed or postmarked  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
5
1
2
until 5:00 o'clock p.m. today.  
The Department staff from the Bureau of  
Professional Licensing also includes Kerry Przybylo.  
So the first set that we will take  
3
4
5
comments for is the "Medicine - General Rules". Karlene  
Ketola. Is it Dr. Ketola?  
6
7
KARLENE KETOLA: No.  
8
MR. MacINTOSH: Karlene, go ahead.  
9
KARLENE KETOLA: All right. Well, good  
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
morning. On behalf of the Michigan Academy of Family  
Physicians, I'm here today to request the Michigan Board  
of Medicine take action to address a critical gap in the  
recognition of AAFP-accredited MAFP Continuing Medical  
Education programs. My name is Karlene Ketola,  
K-a-r-l-e-n-e K-e-t-o-l-a, Chief Executive Officer of the  
Michigan Academy of Family Physicians who represents more  
than 4,200 family physicians and medical students across  
the state. Specifically today, we urge the Michigan  
Board of Medicine to amend Administrative Rule 338.2443  
(Section: Acceptable continuing education; requirements;  
and limitations) to explicitly include the American  
Academy of Family Physicians as a recognized CME  
accreditor. This would ensure that Michigan's family  
physicians can continue to meet their licensure  
requirements with high-quality, evidence-based education.  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
6
1
2
This request also matches CE Broker's request to a change  
as well.  
3
I do want to share the real impact this  
4
issue has caused for Michigan physicians, including the  
following story from one of our Academy's members from  
his perspective:  
5
6
7
I am writing this as a physician licensed  
8
in both Michigan and Florida. I've renewed my Florida  
license in January 2025, and my Michigan license is  
scheduled for renewal this summer. My CME, continuing  
medical education hours, is logged through AAFP and then  
sent to CE Broker which accumulated it for my Florida  
medical license renewal. As I am dually licensed, my CE  
Broker account lists CME accumulated for Florida and  
Michigan. I have reported more than 150 of the necessary  
hours of CME in the current renewal cycle for Michigan,  
but my CE Broker account shows only about two hours of  
CME applicable to Michigan even though all reported hours  
are indicated in my Florida CE Broker account.  
So I have all of these hours of CME  
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
reported and verified by CE Broker sitting in my Florida  
account, but they cannot list the same hours of CME in my  
Michigan account because they serve only as a collection  
agency for each state independently and not as a unified  
repository of data, and that's related to CE Broker. In  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
7
1
2
other words, they cannot use the CME reported to CE  
Broker by AAFP because Michigan does not recognize AAFP  
as a legitimate provider of CME even though the AMA and  
other states do.  
3
4
5
Thus, I've reported CME (through the  
6
services of AAFP) which was valid for Florida but won't  
count for Michigan until Michigan accepts AAFP and MAFP.  
Thus, I am faced with reported CME not being reportable  
to the State of Michigan by CE Broker even though it has  
been reported to CE Broker and even though Michigan wants  
CE Broker to be reporting -- to be its reporting agent  
for all Michigan medical licenses. I request, therefore,  
that AAFP and MAFP expedite this matter and the State --  
and resolve it so that I, and many other Michigan  
physicians, can use already reported CME and earned CME  
for their licensing renewals this spring and summer.  
Thank you in advance for your pivotal  
7
8
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
support with this request for changing an amendment. If  
you have any questions, please contact me at  
517.230.4381, or my email is [email protected]. Thank  
you.  
MR. MacINTOSH: Thank you, Karlene.  
Is there anyone else who wishes to speak  
on the "Medicine - General Rules"? (No response.)  
Hearing none. The second rule set that  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
8
1
2
we'll take comments for is the "Sanitarians - General  
Rules". Is there anyone who wishes to speak on the  
"Sanitarians General Rules"?  
3
4
Hearing none.  
5
If there are no other people who wish to  
speak at this time, we'll take a short recess.  
(Recess from 9:07 a.m. until 9:27 a.m.)  
MR. MacINTOSH: Okay. So we're back on  
the record. Just one last time to check, is there anyone  
who wishes to speak on the "Medicine - General Rules"?  
(No response.)  
6
7
8
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
Hearing none. Is there anyone who wishes  
to speak on the "Sanitarians Registration - General  
Rules"?  
Hearing none.  
If there are no further comments at this  
time, I hereby declare the hearing closed. The record  
will remain open until today at 5:00 o'clock p.m. for any  
other comments you may wish to share about the proposed  
rules. Thank you for coming.  
(At 9:28 a.m., the public hearing concluded.)  
- - -  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
9
1 STATE OF MICHIGAN )  
)
2 COUNTY OF MACOMB )  
3
I, Lori Anne Penn, certify that this  
4
5
transcript consisting of 9 pages is a complete, true, and  
correct record of the proceedings held in the captioned  
matters on Friday, May 16, 2025.  
6
7
I further certify that I am not  
8
responsible for any copies of this transcript not made  
under my direction or control and bearing my original  
signature.  
9
10  
11  
12  
13  
14  
15  
16  
17  
18  
19  
20  
21  
22  
23  
24  
25  
I also certify that I am not a relative  
or employee of or an attorney for a party; or a relative  
or employee of an attorney for a party; or financially  
interested in the action.  
May16, 2025  
_________________ _____  
Date  
Lori
Notan  
My Commission Expires June 15, 2031  
Penn Reporting, LLC - lori.penn@yahoo.com  
;